Robert Howell 0:02

Welcome to the Purpose-Driven Investor, where we build more than portfolios, we build communities. I'm your host, Robert Howell, a real estate investor and founder of Define Communities. Each week we'll explore how purpose and profit connect through affordable housing, land home packages, and impact-driven investing. If you're a lender, land seller, or a partner who believes money should move with meaning, you're in the right place. Today's guest is Saheed. He's the founder of Independent Capital. And over the past six years, he built a really diverse real estate portfolio that includes single-family homes, burrs, small multifamily syndication, a mobile home park, and is now doing private lending, all while continuing to do his full-time job. So I think this is going to be a great story today and show you that proof you don't have to quit your job to be a really successful investor. In fact, maybe your career could be one of your biggest advantages. So appreciate you joining us today. Yeah, no, thanks for having me, Robert. All right, good deal. Well, let's start first with uh just getting to know each other and for the people that are listening. So we'll start at the beginning. Um tell us kind of where you're from, how you got started in your career, and then how you found real estate investing. That's a lot all packed in one question, but just give us the whole deal.

Saeed Zarshenas 1:43

It's a big question, so I'm a little long-winded. But uh, so I'm from Memphis, Tennessee. Uh so I'm from the South. And I went to Tennessee. I've been in Atlanta for Rocky Top. Yeah, go Rocky Top. Go bowls. Um and I've been in Atlanta for uh 10 years now. So I've been here since college, and I currently work in finance, so I work in kind of the private equity world on the lending side, which has been a great experience, and I can talk about that. But in terms of real estate, you know, my parents were always involved in real estate. They actually built a you know small portfolio of single family in Memphis. So I was always around it. I always kind of knew I wanted to do it, but interestingly enough, you know, they they did it with all cash back over while they worked as well. So they still work today. And that's they don't have a 401k, like that's their retirement. And, you know, apparently that was common back then because debt was so expensive and homes were cheaper. Um, but then I also learned about the power of debt, right? It can be tax-free returns, you know, it can be used as a tool to really fuel growth. And that's when I kind of knew I wanted to dig in. So that's when I got involved in real estate. I bought my first property in 2021. It was a duplex remote uh northwest Indiana. And then I built a small portfolio in Cleveland, I bought a mobile home park. Um, and it's been a great experience. Uh and then I've actually started to position more towards lending now. And I can talk about why I made that decision, especially with the W-2. Um, and that's been a great experience for me. Uh, and that's where I'm really focused today. So it's been awesome.

Robert Howell 3:24

That's great. Now um, you're focused on lending. Are you still buying assets also?

Saeed Zarshenas 3:30

You know, I I'm not really spending a lot of time. My time is scarce because I do have a pretty demanding job. So doing that, acquiring and lending and also being married, you know, you gotta you gotta put time everywhere. So uh I've I've put I've taken my foot off the brake for that. You know, I've I enjoy buying and I enjoy turning around properties, like seeing the end result. That's probably where my most of my passion is. But it takes a lot of work to build a portfolio, but also manage one, even if you got property management. Like I have 11 units and then I have an 11 lot mobile home park, and it's not that it takes all week, but it pulls you. And I realized pretty quickly I can't scale this with my job on my own, right? What a lot of people don't realize is like you probably need 60, 80, 100 homes to actually have a strong cash flowing income from real estate like that, from like 100%. Yeah, especially if they're levered up and you're doing burrs, which you're probably doing if you have a portfolio of that size. Um and that's a full-time job just to build, but also maintain. You can't do that on your own. So um it's so that's kind of why I got into lending. Uh because it was more passive, it's very profitable, it's consistent, it's secure, and I'm happy to talk about that. But um, so I'm I'm not really acquiring, I'm actually focusing on building income to replace my income, which lending is does really well. It's very scalable. And then I want to start buying again to mitigate my taxes, multiply my income, and then also build wealth over time. So those two will go hand in hand. So I just kind of reverse the order, which a lot of people I feel like start with buying real estate and then they realize hold on, I need a hundred of these. Like, okay, let me let me figure something else out first.

Robert Howell 5:18

Then I'll dude, I'd love that too. Because I mean, like you said, most people reverse it because it if you asked nine out of ten real estate investors would probably tell you that private lending is the end goal, right? Once you build up a large cash flow or large equity and you get to private lending last. But I love that you're you're really focused on that now first and then grow the assets later.

Saeed Zarshenas 5:44

Yeah, I I agree. Usually that is like people will sell their multifamily buildings and then do lending. Uh it's it's not always the easiest thing to do that in reverse. You obviously need capital. So I've I've been fortunate to have some capital, but also you don't need your own money, you can raise it as well. So you can definitely do it in the reverse order. But that's cool.

Robert Howell 6:03

So growing up, um, your parents had had rental properties. Were you were you in there, like middle school, high school, helping them fix things and working on stuff or helping them find properties?

Saeed Zarshenas 6:16

I mean, we were definitely working on them. There's six of us, all boys. So wow, yeah. They used to spread the work later, then yeah, it was borderline child labor, uh painting, cleaning up brush in the backyards, and it's a Memphis, rougher area. So, like, you know, doing turnovers, like replacing the carpet. It was it was kind of miserable on the weekends, I'm not gonna lie. But you got a lot, I got a lot out of it. I learned from it. I'm still not the handiest person in the world, but uh, it was definitely fun for them at least growing up.

Robert Howell 6:47

Yeah, Memphis is I I love Memphis, it's a good market. I I think I told you my mom is from Memphis and um her whole family's from Memphis, and my first two properties were in Memphis and Orange Mound, and um where the other one was, but I've sold those since and once I got into mobile home parts. But it's a good market for real estate investors to sell.

Saeed Zarshenas 7:09

Definitely a good market. Uh, it can be spotty. I mean, Orange Mound it's a pretty tough area if I'm pretty impossible. Yeah, 100%. Surprised you bought one there knowing it.

Robert Howell 7:18

Yeah, yeah. Well, I think I bought it for like twenty thousand dollars, you know. So hard to walk away from that. Yeah. All right. Well, so let's talk a bit about you know the idea of doing this with a job. So I think you know, on social media, that there's there's a dangerous message sometimes of like, hey, the goal is to quit your job as fast as possible. But you've done the opposite. You've continued to work while building your portfolio and then now getting into the lending. Talk about why you've done it that way.

Saeed Zarshenas 7:49

Yeah, I mean, I think when starting any business, right, there's a lot of risk. You know, even a real estate business, things can go wrong. Things do and will go wrong. And so I I kind of used my job as a safety net to explore the beginning of that process. Um, kind of it also funded all my investments, right? You can go and raise out, raise capital, but a lot of it I wanted to test out on my own. So I use that money to buy real estate, to purchase, to do lending. So it's been helpful in um maybe building the foundation for me. And I think that's important, right? I agree. I mean, I know a lot of people who say, leave your job, like just commit and it's gonna work. But I know a lot of people where it hasn't worked. I know people where it has worked, but they went through a serious dip before it worked out for them, right? Into debt and they they found their way out, but it's just hard. So that security provides me some peace. You know, it's not for everybody, but I think the ability to reinvest that income, especially once you figure it out. Now I'm just reinvesting all my my money from my job into my business, and that compounds over time, right? If you know the power of compound interest, a small amount of money in 30 years can be worth a million dollars. So if you continue to do that, you're only setting yourself up. So I think waiting as long as you can to do both, like obviously there's a limit where you can't, and then that's probably the time to make that transition, but you shouldn't just jump right away. You should definitely uh build the infrastructure, test the investment thesis and get comfortable and then jump because it's always gonna take longer than you think to ramp in any business.

Robert Howell 9:26

Yeah, 100%. What do you think the biggest advantage of having your job uh has given you in your own real estate uh journey?

Saeed Zarshenas 9:33

Oh man, just cash flow, peace of mind, and cash flow to buy and build. Uh and for debt too. If you're borrowing money or if people are even investing in you, they take a lot of comfort in knowing, oh, he's doing really well personally. It's gonna be really hard for him to lose. And also there's some protection, it just it puts people at peace, honestly. So it makes it a lot easier just to grow capital.

Robert Howell 9:56

Yeah, I love that. And I when I have these conversations with people about, hey, I want to get into real estate, I always tell them, like, hey, your job's really not holding you back. It actually probably is funding your future freedom. I imagine you'd probably agree with that, right?

Saeed Zarshenas 10:11

Yeah, especially starting out. I mean, it's it's a great way to get started. Again, I there's probably an inflection point when it maybe makes sense to transition, but uh definitely starting out 100%. That's great.

Robert Howell 10:24

Well, cool. Well, let's um let's talk about lending, and I want to spend some time over lending, uh and talk about how you got into lending um and where you've learned how to be a lender.

Saeed Zarshenas 10:42

Yeah. So again, how kind of how I got into lending, you know, I started to build a portfolio, uh, and very quickly I realized like this is taking a lot of time, and I'm not even at massive scale yet. I'm not making a ton of cash flow. Money keeps being pulled for catbacks for repairs. And I work probably 60 to 80 hours a week in my W 2. So it's it's it's a demanding job. It's not like a 48-hour week job. So it can be done, but I realized that's not the way I'm gonna be able to replace or replicate that income. So I I realized I either needed to find a partner or find a new strategy. And that's when I found lending. You know, I I did that just through networking, going to events, talking to people on Facebook, and I got really eager and I jumped in probably a little too fast. So my first loan I did was a gap, uh second lane loan. I don't know if you're familiar. Um very risky. You know, you're behind the first lane, so you're not priority. And usually you're doing that because the borrower doesn't want to bring any money to close, so they have no skin in the game. I was eager, I didn't really understand the risk, and I essentially lost all my money on that deal. It was my first loan, and it wasn't a small amount of money. And you know, now I hear like four out of five of those second lien deals actually fail. It's not uncommon. Yeah, it's pretty high uh for the reasons I mentioned. Um and in that moment, I was kind of like, I don't even want to look do another loan. Like, this is miserable. It's not miserable. And I kind of asked myself, you could walk away now, just write it off, don't tell anybody this happened, you know, hide the shame, or you could lean into it and realize what did you do wrong, right? Can you learn from it? And so I chose the latter. And since then, you know, I've only done first lane loans, I don't do second lien anymore, and it's been a great experience. Um, I've done 35 plus deals. Um, over three years, a lot of that I've been scaling, so more recent, and it's been a great experience. Um, I can talk about why I like lending, but it's the main reason coming back was it's very passive relative to acquiring and building a portfolio. And that fits my lifestyle. Again, working at my job from a W-2 perspective. I can work five hours a week on it and make you know a couple hundred grand a year if you have enough capital. Like it doesn't require a lot once you figure it out. You have to build it, but once you do, it's pretty streamlined.

Robert Howell 13:18

That's huge. And do you talk about where you lend? Because I'm sure there's people that are going to be listening here about you know that that have deals that are coming up. Um, so talk about where you lend and what kind of assets that you lend on.

Saeed Zarshenas 13:33

Yeah, so I'm in Georgia, South Carolina, and North Carolina. I've done some Cleveland in the past, but I'm actually moving out of the Cleveland, Ohio market. Um, so I'm really focused on the South and the Southeast. I've done mainly single family, small multi in the past, like anywhere between $100,000 to $150,000 loan size. Um, but more lately, I've actually been leaning into the land home package uh market. You know, I actually learned about it from people and really from you at that one mastermind we were at. Uh kind of my eyes. And the reason I'm leaning into that is, you know, it seems to be kind of a misunderstood market. There's a massive disconnect between supply and demand. So it's a little more blue ocean, in my view, versus like single family. So there's a lot of demand. Uh, you can get a good yield. And because there's that disconnect, you know, you can get pretty good terms. Like loan to value is much lower than you would see on a single family. It's also consistent. Um, the model to do that is like the same forever deal almost with some caveats, right? You're not opening the floors, you're not opening the walls and finding mold, old electrical, you know, you're buying land, you're scraping it, you're putting a home down, and you're graveling the road and putting in a septic. Um, I'm simplifying that. But and when you can do that, you kind of really mitigate the risk, which with lending, risk management is one-on-one. So, like if you can have high consistency into what the project's gonna require, you can like lower your risk overall. So that that's why I like it. Um, and that's why I've been more focused on it lately.

Robert Howell 15:17

That's huge. Yeah. So we're gonna be Saheed's the the land home go-to guy. Yeah, give me a call. All right, let's go. Um, do you service your own loans or do you have a servicer that services them?

Saeed Zarshenas 15:31

I service my own loans, you know. Okay. Um, yeah, I service my own loans. A lot of it's my money. I do have a lot of it is investor capital too. You know, I'm still scaling there. I don't have like a $20 million portfolio. That's that's that's set in the goals. It's written on the wall somewhere. Uh, but you know, it's it's been a good experience. And as I scale, maybe that's something I would take on. But again, you don't really need to. Um, I know people who manage a $40 million loan portfolio and it's just two people. Like it's definitely doable doable and coming back to it can be a pretty passive investment.

Robert Howell 16:07

That's huge. What's your as you think about your goal a year from now, three years from now, on a lending side, what have you thought about that far out? Um, or just kind of just been naturally evolving and you know, you're you're here and you want to loan more money.

Saeed Zarshenas 16:23

Yeah, no, I'd say it's been naturally evolving, like historically. Uh this year I've really leaned into it. Um, I doubled my portfolio size, raising capital. I'm at like 1.5 to 2 million today. And I want to get to three by the end of the year and probably double that next year is the goal. And with that, you know, that should be a substantial amount of income. And then once I've built the income, I'll probably pivot back to buying assets, right? Coming back to using depreciation to offset all that income, multiply it, and then also that's going to build wealth, compound wealth in the future via real estate is kind of the strategy, which I think you do something similar, Robert, if I'm not mistaken.

Robert Howell 17:12

Yeah, for sure. With mobile home parks. Um, so I bought I bought a bunch of mobile home parts 2021 to 2024, didn't pay many taxes, which was great. 2025, I didn't buy as many, uh, so I paid more taxes. So I'm back to buying uh we got several mobile home parks under contract right now. And um trying to trying to reduce the taxes as much as possible, but at the same time not being cash poor. That's the balance is you can depreciate and do cost segregations, but you still have to have equity into the asset, right? For most of them. And you want to make sure that equity doesn't outweigh the uh tax savings, right? And that's that's where I got to 2020, 2021, 2024. I own a bunch of mobile home parts, but I never had any cash. And so trying to trying to build that cash back up and balance, but balance tax because it's it's no fun paying the government.

Saeed Zarshenas 18:10

Yeah, I mean it's that's the story of real estate, right? Asset rich, uh cash poor. So I like lending, it's cash rich. That's funny what my wife, yeah. My wife sometimes says she's like, you know, one day it'll be like, oh, we're gonna buy a beach house and we're gonna live on the ocean, and then next day it's like we're moving to the mobile home park, you know? So you never know.

Robert Howell 18:35

Um well cool. So uh you mentioned that you you have raised some outside capital, and maybe there's there's people listening that that have capital and want to invest in a fund. Is it a fund that you're um you're utilizing and bringing in third-party investors, like private, private money type people? Or uh how's that structured?

Saeed Zarshenas 18:56

Uh it's a it's a servicer model, so it's not a fund model. Like a fund model has a lot of like regulatory SEC requirements, but a servicer model. So essentially you would be put, if someone was interested, they would let me know. I would send them a deal and like, oh, this is a good deal. We would talk through it. And then I'll be like, okay, we work with title, draft up the documents, and they would be directly placed onto the promissory note, the personal guarantee, um, and the mortgage, uh, along with my money, if they didn't have enough money, like they don't have to bring the full amount of money to do the work. Um, so you can get in for a smaller balance, which a lot of people like. But the benefit of that versus the fund model is you're actually have full visibility into where your money's going, right? You're you're wiring it directly to title, you're not wiring it to me, which I think a lot of people take comfort in that. But the fund model, you you're betting on the operator, right? You're sending them the money and you're hoping to do what they say they're gonna do, but they know exactly where their money's going, and then it's hands-off. All the those approved, like I want to do this one, send the money. I'm gonna manage the borrower, I'm gonna manage the legal, I'm gonna manage the uh interest payments, and they're gonna get their payment every month, first of the month, uh, mailbox money. And then when it pays off, it sells, it goes directly from title back to them. So the money's secure, uh, directly linked to it. And that's really I found the way investors want to do it because they have a lot more comfort than just sending them money to some money.

Robert Howell 20:27

Yeah. That's huge. And it's nice to know that hey, maybe you don't have enough money if you're an investor, you don't have enough money for an entire deal, but you want to still be involved because there's a lot of people out there like that. They could partner with you and you all could share in the deal. I think that's smart.

Saeed Zarshenas 20:43

Yeah, 100%. And it also helps people get a little more comfort of like testing it out instead of like doing a $200,000 loan, like you know, $30,000, see if they like it, and then they can rant from there or or decide it's not for them, you know. Everyone's got a different taste.

Robert Howell 21:00

Yeah, that's great. All right. Well, um, let's let's go back to uh advice for people with jobs. Um, and you kind of touched on this already, but imagine there's somebody listening, maybe a teacher or an engineer, maybe they work in healthcare. Um, they want to invest, but they think they need to quit first. Reality is they don't. What would you tell them in terms of taking that first step into real estate while keeping their job?

Saeed Zarshenas 21:27

Man, I would say partnership. I mean, as someone like there's a lot of ways you can bring value to a deal, right? Capital, time, like management of the deal, sourcing the deal. And that doesn't have to be all done by one person. You know, as someone with a W 2, you can likely bring capital. You can probably even bring some management from your computer late night or over the weekend, right? You're probably not out there cold calling, sourcing the deal, or even boots on the ground. So partnership is probably the best. Way to do it with a W-2. I personally know people who have W-2s with massive rental portfolios, like hundreds of units. So it can be done. And just you got to make sure it's someone you trust. But I I would say partnership, building a team, or outsourcing whatever you can and just knowing what your value is and bringing that to the table.

Robert Howell 22:20

Love it. That's awesome. And 100% agree with that because everybody has a strength, right? But there's all you have weaknesses too. I mean, one of those strength is having a job, but also you know, your time is limited. So partner together uh with someone that can match uh what you need. So with that being said, if we broke it if we broke it down, um if you had to tell them, hey, here's one thing that you should go do this month in order to move towards financial freedom through real estate or through lending, what would that one thing be?

Saeed Zarshenas 22:54

Man, I would say going to a networking event or joining um leadership in like something you're interested in, mobile home parks, lending, what um multifamily, Burr, like and like an I would say an intimate one, not like a 40-person one, right? Like go and just start talking to people because everyone's always looking for capital or something that they're missing, and you'd be surprised what you could find. So I I would say that, and I I do think there's a lot of value in mentorships, even if they're paid. I know there's like a stigma sometimes on the gurus, and there's some bad ones out there, but as long as you like look at referrals and do the diligence up front and make sure it's legit. Like I've never not done a mentorship and not gotten my money back tenfold. Um, so as long as you are intentional about it, you can join a mentorship and just show up and then that's it. But you have to be intentional as well. You have to be like, okay, I'm gonna do the homework, I'm gonna listen, I'm gonna follow up, I'm gonna network with the people in here. And that's that's how you get value.

Robert Howell 23:59

Love it. That's great. All right, so let's conclude here with some rapid fire questions for you. Um, let's see here. I've got three or four of those. Um what's your favorite investment that you've ever made?

Saeed Zarshenas 24:13

Uh my mobile home park. I mean, hands down, best ROI. Turn, I mean, it was a huge value ad. So if you would ask me when I bought it for a year, I probably said it was my most hated. Uh but turnkey to own home, cash flow, one call a month, maybe most profitable investment by far. Mob mobile home parks.

Robert Howell 24:35

Let's go. All right, what's your favorite business book?

Saeed Zarshenas 24:39

Uh I mean, I don't honestly don't read a lot, uh, but if I had to pick my favorite book, it'd probably be Atomic Habits. Um so I think you can get a lot of things out of that. Like small things over time compound to big things. It's not just money, that's even your actions.

Robert Howell 24:57

So yeah. Yeah, that's cool. Um, it may remind me, I I I can't remember exactly what he said, but I was watching a video from Ed Mallet on Instagram yesterday. Um, and he talked about that as like small things over and over again end up being big things later.

Saeed Zarshenas 25:15

Um I think that's that's so true for people in a W 2 because you don't have a lot of time. So like you don't it's just small things every other night or over the weekend over time. Like that's how I got started. Like so that's great.

Robert Howell 25:29

All right, last uh rapid fire here. What's one daily habit that has helped you succeed?

Saeed Zarshenas 25:35

Oh man, I I can be bad at it, uh, if I'm being totally honest, but it's journaling. Um, I don't know if you've heard of the intentional journal. Uh it's a bigger product, uh bigger pockets product, but I'm I think there's a lot of them out there. But essentially you have a three-month goal that feeds into your yearly and your five-year, and then you break it down all the way into weekly and daily habits and action items like KPIs, and you journal every morning, every night, and at the end of the week. And it's all about reflection what worked, what didn't work. And every time I've done it, I've seen so much progress towards my goals because it holds you accountable. You become intentional, right? So that is something I think a lot of people overlook. It sounds cheesy, but it it really does have an impact. I think if you write down your goals, you're way more likely to achieve them than just talking about them.

Robert Howell 26:31

Yeah, 100%. I'm part of Dan Martell's group, and um he's got five daily non-negotiables that he encourages people to do. One of those is reviewing your goals three times a day. Um, and just that, you know, top of mind refresh every three times a day pushes you towards okay, am I doing the things today to achieve those goals?

Saeed Zarshenas 26:51

Yeah. I mean, so you do that every every day?

Robert Howell 26:54

I'm I'm kind of like you with the journaling. I I mean that's the intent, right? But um I I don't do it every day. I need to. Didn't mean to call you out there.

Saeed Zarshenas 27:04

Come on out.

Robert Howell 27:05

All right. Well, hey, I really appreciate you coming on. Uh this has been really great because I think your your story really encourages people that financial freedom isn't about necessarily quitting a job or making a huge leap. It's about making those smart decisions consistently day in and day out, and those small decisions add up, uh, and smart decisions add up over time into big things. Um, so really, really great. I appreciate you joining. Where can people reach you if they want to connect with you?

Saeed Zarshenas 27:37

Uh Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook. Um, so my name's Said Zarshness. I think my Instagram handle is sai.j.z. Uh, but I'm I'm on all three of those platforms. You can message me, even if you just have questions about lending or real estate. I'm always happy to talk about my experiences. So sweet.

Robert Howell 27:57

All right. Well, appreciate everybody joining, listening. If you got value, make sure you hit the subscribe here, share it with somebody who's trying to build wealth, maybe without quitting their job. Um, and thanks for listening to the purpose-driven investor podcast. We'll see you next time. Thanks for listening to the Purpose Driven Investor. If today's episode sparked an idea or inspired you to make an impact, connect with me at howellandsons.com. Join our community of purpose driven investors who are helping families find stable homes while building real returns. Because when we invest with purpose, everyone wins.